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johnaec
11-24-2006, 08:18 PM
I picked up a nice pair of XPL140A's today, (craigslist, and no joke - they were replacing them with Bose!). They're black lacquer, ('perfectly match my XPL200a's!), in *mint* condition, (other than 2 broken grille pegs), stands included, but I'm a little confused about the hookup.

I've posted the schematic below, and as can be seen, there are no internal connections between the LF and MF/HF sections, and there are also separate external +/- connectors. But unlike the XPL200A's, there's no bi-amp switch, and these are also missing the little plates that connect the LF and MF/HF sections - I'm assuming the sellers were connecting the amp leads across both sections.

For plain stereo operation, hooking up both sections to the same speaker cable is normal, correct? (Anyone have a spare set of strapping bars?) But without a bi-amp switch, are these somehow still bi-ampable? If so, I assume an electronic crossover is still needed, or can I simply run one amp to the LF and another to the MF/HF? (Like I mentioned in another thread, I'm no electronics expert when it comes to crossovers. :o: )

OK - I just downloaded the manual from JBL, and I see they show both bi-wire and "bi-amp" operation. This is in the second pic. It looks like I'd still need an active crossover for true bi-amp, since without one, I'd still be sending full frequencies to both the LF and MF/HF sections of the internal crossovers. And with the internal crossovers in such a circuit, wouldn't there be an additive effect of the crossovers if an active crossover were still used??

I haven't hooked them up yet, but without an active crossover ahead of the amps, I don't see a real sonic advantage to using 4 amps, since all speaker leads would be carrying the same frequencies.

Am I missing something here? With the internal crossovers, is it technically a bad idea to run an active crossover for true bi-amping?

'Any suggestions much appreciated!

Also - a couple pics of the units at the end.

Thanks - John

Zilch
11-24-2006, 08:29 PM
Some purist nutcases would argue the advantage to Fig.1 accrues from no IR voltage drop in the HF wires. Of course, if you used Zilch Wonder Cable for the HF, there'd be other advantages, as well.... :p

Fig. 2 allows using different types of amps for LF and HF. Bottleheads and chipamp enthusiasts like that.

No active XO is required or desired in either case, though I could make something up to sell stuff, as desired.... ;)

Titanium Dome
11-24-2006, 08:33 PM
Nice pick up. With XPL140s (and probably XPL160s) I don't see any advantage to bi-amping unless you have very specific amplifier signatures you want to send to the HF and LF inputs.

oznob
11-24-2006, 08:36 PM
Hey John, nice score! You can jump the terminals with speaker wire. Get four small lengths, about two inches each should be good. Strip off both ends like normal and place the ends into the binding post holes, black to black, red to red. You will only need one length of speaker wire from your receiver/amp. Bananna plugs work best but you can put the bare speaker wire into the corresponding hole in conjuction with your home-made jumpers. The only problem would be the size of the hole that's why it's best to use bananns. Good luck and, again, nice score!

johnaec
11-24-2006, 09:22 PM
Hi, Oz. 'How are the 4410's coming along?

I actually have the strapping bars from my XPL200's I can use, but it'd be nice to have them for both. And I know I can use any number of other methods to connect them together. Some have even said wires sound better than the straps. Also, when I picked these up, they had the stands assembled incorrectly and mounted backwards - you can see the way they had them in the craigslist pic. But 'easy to take apart and fix.

'Try to stop over the next time you're down. Maybe we can even get Zilch, (and any other locals - 'always welcome), to stop by for a listening party.

Now I just need to find an XPL-"center", (and HDTV), to have a nice little surround system...

John

oznob
11-24-2006, 10:30 PM
Sounds like a good time! I am hoping Daniel will have the surrounds done on the woofers next week. May be able to come down Friday or Saturday. I will keep you posted. I am using home made jumpers, silver plated 10 gauge copper, with spades on the 890's. The speaker cable is the same wire terminated with banannas. A friend of mine in Texas makes cables as a hobby and set me up. I am also using his silver plated inter-connects. The jury is still out whether it makes a real sonic difference, at least to my ears.

:cheers:

johnaec
11-26-2006, 11:33 AM
I finally got these hooked up, but just plain stereo mode.

As part of the sale, I also picked up some Technics gear with them, (only $50 more - what's to lose...), and Monster speaker cables were included as well.

The Technics units are SU-G91 5-channel amp, (heavy - rated 130 watt/ch.), 'says "New Class A" (??), SL-PD825 5-disc CD changer, ST-K50 tuner, and SH-8017 dual 7-band EQ, (I know, I know...). Unfortunately, they're missing any remotes - I'm hoping I can get a universal one that's compatible.

The speakers work great!! :bouncy: 'No problems at all! And even hooked up to this Technics stuff, it's obvious they are a close match to the sound of the XPL200A's, even though the 093Ti is crossed over at 900hz and 4Khz in the 140's, as compared to 1.1K and 4.5K in the 200's. I'll have to get them out in the living room where the XPL200A's are for a more direct comparison to really see how close they are.

For now, they're in a room that has some L3's and 4408A's, (both of which are just 2-ways with 8" LF). For valid comparisons with these, I'll need to test them with the same electronics. I wish I had a big patch bay that covered all my electronics inputs and outputs, ('anyone ever seen one?), but at least I have some switching boxes for speakers, which makes it a little easier. I'll report back on comparisons sometime in the near future, hopefully including some basic RTA curves.

All in all, I'm very impressed with the sound of these speakers! For high-output full range, they could obviously use a subwoofer, but they still do quite well with the 8" 116H-3's, especially since the cabinet size is pretty decent.

I'd been considering selling my XPL200A's, ('find I listen to the 4430's more - I like the 2235's for bass), but now that I've got these matching smaller ones, I believe I'll keep them with an eye to future home theater use. And I'd really like to find a pair of stands for the XPL200A's - if anyone ever comes across a pair, definitely let me know!

Pics of the Technics stuff below.

John

oznob
11-26-2006, 04:22 PM
Hey John. I think soon you will need to build another room or convert your garage!

johnaec
11-26-2006, 07:01 PM
Hey John. I think soon you will need to build another room or convert your garage!Or maybe not...after playing the 140's pretty loud for about an hour, I noticed one of the 116H-3 surrounds had developed a tear in the suspension. :( They'd appeared perfect at purchase, if a little dry, but it's now obvious the suspensions were on their last legs. I've already got a set here that can go on, ('had them waiting to go on some 116H-2's - hopefully they're close enough), but in the meantime, I think I'll pull a set of truly almost new 116H-3's from a pair of the 4408A's I picked up a few months ago. That still leaves one other set of 4408A's to compare with at some time.

John

Zilch
11-26-2006, 07:24 PM
I suspect 116H-3 is different from H-2.

I haven't seen the T/S parameters on H-3, but we can do a quick measure with WT2 on the remaining one if you bring it next time you come down this way.... :yes:

Johnny_Law
12-03-2018, 06:14 PM
Reply from the dead - I'm looking for an XPL140 (non-A) tech sheet. Does anyone know if this exists?

Thanks,
Ryan