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View Full Version : Bob Dylan, Boston Herald page 3 8/23/06



majick47
08-24-2006, 08:40 AM
The tunes, they are a changin' for the worst, says Bob Dylan. Quotes from a recent Rolling Stone article. "You listen to these modern records, they're atrocious, they have sound all over the them" he added, "There's no definition of nothing, no vocal, no nothing, just like---static." Commenting on a recent recording he made, "Even these songs sounded 10 times better in the studio, when we recorded 'em. CDs are small. There's no stature to it." Another quote, "I don't know anybody who's made a record that sounds decent in the past 20 years, really." I have to agree with Bob Dylan and the great precentage of todays popular music is poorly recorded and the singers/musicians sorely lack any real talent.

hjames
08-24-2006, 10:03 AM
The tunes, they are a changin' for the worst, says Bob Dylan. Quotes from a recent Rolling Stone article. "You listen to these modern records, they're atrocious, they have sound all over the them" he added, "There's no definition of nothing, no vocal, no nothing, just like---static." Commenting on a recent recording he made, "Even these songs sounded 10 times better in the studio, when we recorded 'em. CDs are small. There's no stature to it." Another quote, "I don't know anybody who's made a record that sounds decent in the past 20 years, really." I have to agree with Bob Dylan and the great precentage of todays popular music is poorly recorded and the singers/musicians sorely lack any real talent.
Of course, the Washington Post savaged his recent concert in the DC area -Dylan, Wheezin' In the Wind (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/20/AR2006082000713.html)In that column the reporter said
"Dylan's voice has withered over the course of his storied 65 years. Nor is his tendency to rearrange the phrasing and melodies of his songs to suit those battered pipes. But these days, the man sounds less like a rock-and-roll icon and more like Cookie Monster with a head cold."

"It was a once-in-a-lifetime moment: One where you wished those drunk dudes singing behind you would cut loose and drown out the guy onstage."

I don't know where they get these young kids doing reviews - I have a vinyl copy of "Before the Flood" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000025OU/sr=8-1/qid=1156435171/ref=pd_bbs_1/104-0904931-7259949?ie=UTF8)(Dylan and The Band, circa '74) and it used to drive me crazy to hear Dylan's "Shoutin' out the lyrics" way of singing on that album ... ya gotta wonder what folks expect when they go to see a legend like Dylan ...

moldyoldy
08-24-2006, 12:47 PM
While I can't say there's been no good recordings in the last 20, I'd definitely agree there's been too damn few. Then again, to be fair, that's what my folks said in '69.

Yeah, Bob had his head up his ass during the period he had The Band at his disposal, either he was a couple years behind, or they were a couple years ahead. That said, "Music from Big Pink" and "The Basement Tapes" are both still in my all-time Top 20, even though the recording quality was rather dubious. (Did I spell that right, or was it doobious?)

I have tickets to see Levon and his daughter jam with some local boys (The Cate Brothers) this Sunday.:bouncy:

"I'm goin' ALL the way, till the wheels fall off and burn!" ("Brownsville Girl")

Zilch
08-24-2006, 01:34 PM
Anyone what thinks Dylan was ever about singing is unclear on the concept.... ;)

BMWCCA
08-24-2006, 03:10 PM
I saw him at what I was led to believe was his first concert after "the accident". It was The Band concert at the Mississippi River Summer Festival at Southern Illinois Universtity (SIU) in Edwardsville, IL. The year may have been 1969. He came out as a surprise though there had been mumblings all evening. It was the debut of the even-whinier Dylan voice. I have to agree, he was never about the singing and all about the words. As a songwriter, though, much of his stuff got great new life at the hands of others like David Crosby and the Byrds. I never was a Dylan fan but it doesn't mean I can't respect the groundbreaking aspect of his career. It's tough to describe to my kids exactly what his legacy is, and it probably won't be helped when Cate Blanchett plays Dylan in the upcoming movie of his life. Though my daughter does like most of "his" Byrds songs.

Since we're talking recordings here, I'm very fond of most of Donald Fagen's from a quality standpoint. Got to see Steely Dan in DC last week, in fact. And much of Bruce Cockburn is very listenable and well-recorded recently, including his live stuff. Somewhat of a Dylan-esque figure himself. If you like modern troubadours, try a guy named Kenny White's album "Symphony in 16 Bars" (http://www.kennywhite.net/cd.htm).

scott fitlin
08-24-2006, 03:33 PM
Well, I`ve been saying this for quite some time now! They dont make good sounding hit oriented pop music anymore. It has become all electronic, and most of it is poorly recorded, with lack of good recording and mastering engineers, and especially in dance music, lack of vocalists, and musicians altogether!

Then there,s Hip Hop, the disease that has spread across the United States and the World, but, this is what the kids want now!

In NYC we always had a proliferation of hit oriented radio stations playing new music! Its kind of funny how NYC now has many stations playing classic music, 60,s 70,s and 80,s hit oriented pop music, from rock to R & B, but not that many new music stations like htere used to be.

And recording label executives are wondering why people arent buying music like we use to! I would think if they put out a product everyone wanted.....?

moldyoldy
08-24-2006, 11:36 PM
Lots of parallels can be drawn between pop music and sound gear from the 50s onward till today. From a non-technical, enjoyment-only POV, both seemed to peak long ago, then just kinda ran out of gas. Maybe it was just the drugs (on both counts). Whatever it was, it sure seems to have stuck with a lot of us. Sure never thought I'd grow old talkin' 'bout the "good old days" (shudder).

For the like-minded, there's a good book well worth picking up (This Wheel's on Fire). An interesting read mainly on the life and times of The Band, starting in the Ronnie Hawkins (The Hawks) days, and lots of stuff involving Bob D, several of the old bluesmen from the King Biscuit days, and others;

http://theband.hiof.no/books/this_wheels_on_fire.html

Rolf
08-25-2006, 01:04 AM
Here is the same article in our local newspaper. And yes, he is right with some exceptions.

Ducatista47
08-25-2006, 08:35 AM
I am still reticent to throw an "it stinks" blanket over any newer style, including rap. Maybe I'm just too fearful of sounding like my grandparents (My Grandmother said, "I don't see what all the fuss is about this Alice Presley"). Just because I am ignorant doesn't mean I want to sound ignorant.

I think traditionalists in 1955-1956 were lamenting the relative lack of musicial content in early rock, relative to the corporate and classical music that preceeded it. The problem I had at the time was that I felt - and still feel - the aforementioned corporate musicial content sucked. In 1952 or '53, the #1 record was Music Music Music by Teresa Brewer (Put another nickel in, in the nickelodeon...). In those days it was difficult to tell songs on Your Hit Parade, a weekly TV show where in house talent sang the week's top sellers - I swear to God - from show tunes. You can't hear a hint of blues ancestry in either type, so I always thought they lacked heart or taste. Entertainment without art. By the way, popular instrumentals in 1953 or so where cutsey novelty studio musician stuff like The Waltzing Cat and The Syncopated Clock, and don't forget The Typewriter Song. Good jazz wasn't on popular radio by then.

Since I know previous and current listeners said/say the same thing (dearth of musical content) about blues, it is an observation to be used more intelligently than it usually is. Why I mention all this is Rap. That would be my main gripe with it. The musical (vs social, cultural and attitude) content plunged to a new low in relation to styles that preceeded it. I am tempted to observe here that attitude is no substitute for talent, and there is the magic word. Talent should be the barometer, I think. That would be musicial talent, as we are talking about music, not units sold or cultural manifestos.

So where does that leave Dylan? Mr. Cultural Manifesto. I think he's pretty musical when he composes, and his singing is often most artful. Billie Holiday had a lousy set of pipes and Whitney Houston has world class vocal cords, but which is the better singer? And who sang better material? I'll take Bob & Billie.

Clark in Peoria, Old Fogey?

scott fitlin
08-25-2006, 01:26 PM
I am still reticent to throw an "it stinks" blanket over any newer style, including rap.I used to be reticent about this too, but the lyrics in todays Hip Hop?

Not what I want my children to listen to and set up their values and priorities according to!

No way, Hip Hop, the disease that has spread Nationwide!

Ducatista47
08-25-2006, 10:53 PM
Scotty, You won't get any argument from me that the hip-hop culture is corrosive. It replaces good thoughts with egocentric, violent, materialistic and often racist longings. It wants you to be like a drunk. Nothing is your fault, you have a pass on having to behave, and if someone has something and you don't, take it. an' poppa cap in his mofo ass while yo' at it.

Nice people. I can't wait for my daughter to get together with them.:barf:

Clark in Peoria

JohanR
08-29-2006, 08:06 AM
I have to agree with Bob here. In my book pop/rock peaked, in sound quality and musical quality, around 1970. Of course there has allways been highly commercial, sell this week, hope they have forgotten it next week, music around, but I must say they did it better in older days. Just think of 1960's Motown, as factory made as there ever was, but so good.

JohanR

Titanium Dome
08-29-2006, 05:34 PM
Glad to see old fartism is alive and well. :rotfl:

If I close my eyes, I'd swear it was my old man griping in the background: "Turn that g-d s#it down! You call that music? I don't want that crap in my house!"

Of course, the music in my day was all about sex, drugs, and rock'n'roll. These were much higher ideals that money, fame, and power, which is the hedonistc mantra of hip hop.

Sex, drugs, and rock'n'roll was the cultural backlash to the agenda of our parents. Money, fame, and power is the backlash to the agenda of our generation. Can't wait to see what the backlash is to this generation's agenda.

Speakers, hi fidelity reproduction, and music did not peak in the past. They're better, more prevalent, and more evolved today than ever. Avoid making the mistake that one particular genre defines music, regardless of its apparent popularity. There is a greater proliferation of great music, musical recordings, musical performances, and musical broadcasting than ever before.

There's no doubt in the work that I do that hip hop culture and gang culture contribute to the destruction of cultural norms. Nevertheless, to write off all of popular culture or to even imagine that what the media represents as popular culture really is popular culture is to give in to the notion that popular art predicts culture rather than the other way around.

If parents and society did right by their kids, the music would take care of itself.

In the mean time, there's more great music out there than I'll ever be able to listen to or buy. Why would I let a few giant media conglomerates, the lap dog entertainment press, dissembling corporate marketers, and a dried up old husk of a folk idol convince me there isn't? :dont-know

Zilch
08-29-2006, 07:13 PM
and a dried up old husk of a folk idol....


***Zilch konks Ti Dome with a three-disk Dylan anthology***







[And a hardbound copy of "Don't Look Back." :D ]

Titanium Dome
08-29-2006, 09:49 PM
***Zilch konks Ti Dome with a three-disk Dylan anthology***







[And a hardbound copy of "Don't Look Back." :D ]


:rotfl: and deservedly so. I've got to learn to respect my elders. Maybe when I'm 60.

Titanium Dome
08-30-2006, 08:05 AM
Then this morning I discover this, which I found to be hugely humorous given this thread. :rotfl:

http://www.apple.com/ipod/ads/dylan/

Ducatista47
08-30-2006, 08:25 AM
Well, Dome, the visuals are typical corporate post 90's tripe for the attention span deprived. Looks like a commercial, which it is. The dancing listener's wild inappropriateness is very funny indeed. The singing, however, sounds very much like some of my favorite classic Chess Records artists aka Chicago Blues. So does the beat. I'll buy it from Bob. Now Britney Spears or Jessica Simpson, that would be technicolor yawn time.

Thanks for the link, Clark

moldyoldy
08-30-2006, 11:20 AM
....Sex, drugs, and rock'n'roll was the cultural backlash to the agenda of our parents. Money, fame, and power is the backlash to the agenda of our generation. Can't wait to see what the backlash is to this generation's agenda.

Speakers, hi fidelity reproduction, and music did not peak in the past. They're better, more prevalent, and more evolved today than ever. Avoid making the mistake that one particular genre defines music, regardless of its apparent popularity. There is a greater proliferation of great music, musical recordings, musical performances, and musical broadcasting than ever before.

Hi, TiDome,

I thought money, fame, and power WAS our generation's (current) agenda, not the backlash to it? When I try to subjectively compare the merits of conciousness-expansion, 60's music, and a new girl every week vs Wall St, gangsta rap, and soccer moms, well, it just don't add up.

As to the "peaking" or lack of, regarding new music, I'd really love to believe like you, that everything's just gettin' better and better, but what I hear just doesn't convince me. Mebbe I'm lookin' in the wrong places. Suggestions?

Titanium Dome
08-30-2006, 03:56 PM
(snip)Suggestions?

The Classical repertoire is larger and livelier than ever, with new recordings, new artists, and new composers abundant. Not only that, but Classical music is a growing force in music sales, especially under the "new" music economy.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/28/arts/music/28kozi.html?ex=1306468800&en=5b5994636af18d73&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

I'm still a member of the BMG Classical Music Club, and I could spend $1000 a month on new stuff.

The jazz scene is bigger than ever, with wider acceptance of jazz in all its forms than ever before. New, smart musicians are all over the place. I went to 14 jazz concerts last year alone and heard more that thirty artists. I ended up buying music from more than half of them within the year. Check out the mix of old and new artists here:

http://www.jazzreview.com/

It's a smorgasbord of fine listening.

Not everyone's cup of tea, but fill my ThermosŪ with dance track, electronic, and trance music. It's innovative, sensual, moody, motivating, soothing, driving, dreaming, and it's tearing up the music world in Europe, Asia, and Metro America. It's truly international, almost completely outside the mainstream music establishment, and full of innovators of all ages. When I was a teenager, Beatles, Beach Boys, and Bee Gees tunes would play in my head all day. Now it's 4 Strings, Madelyn, and Sasha.

http://electro-music.com/

http://www.moodbook.com/music/trance.html

There's a whole lot more to cover, but these are great places to start. :yes:

moldyoldy
08-30-2006, 07:00 PM
Wow, TiDome, Thanks a lot! You have me swaying my position by your enthusiasm alone.:applaud: I aleady can tell I'll be spending some time at jazzreview, and I guess I'd just been ignoring classical (that probably goes way back to childhood piano lessons from a mean old German lady). I love blues most, and must admit to liking several of the "kids" that are trying their hand at it now. I have doubts I'll ever be able to do the techno, I've just got this hangup about thinking music should at least use a few real acoustic musical instruments driven by a spark of emotion. Maybe I just need to think of another name for it. I'll give it a fair shot though for your sake, I hope to never become such an old dog I can't learn new tricks.

I've tried to plant some seeds of musical interest with some of my friends' kids, by fixing up and giving away 4 old Wurlitzer electric pianos (the old student models). I stipulated to the kids and their parents that lessons wouldn't be forced on anyone, they could just mess around and see if they were interested, give 'em to others if not. So far, two have begged their folks for lessons, and are both showing considerable promise. Both want to play boogie-woogie and ragtime.....no idea where that came from....maybe there is hope for the future.

Thanks Again!

Titanium Dome
08-30-2006, 08:21 PM
(snip)I have doubts I'll ever be able to do the techno, I've just got this hangup about thinking music should at least use a few real acoustic musical instruments driven by a spark of emotion. Maybe I just need to think of another name for it. I'll give it a fair shot though for your sake, I hope to never become such an old dog I can't learn new tricks.(snip)

Thanks Again!


I understand your feelings.

When the saxophone came along, there was a lot of resistance from the music establishment toward this bastard instrument: woodwind? brass horn? Alpen horn? :wtf:

The electric guitar and electric bass were considered unnatural and soulless (or if they had souls, thet were evil). Electric piano? Synthesizer? MIDI keyboard? Samples? Rhythm machines? Whoa!

I think it's all part of the continuation of musical evolution. The neat thing about the evolution of music is that its origins remain alive while the species keeps expanding. :bouncy:

Great job with the kids and the organs. :yes:

Ducatista47
08-30-2006, 10:23 PM
Dome, thanks for the new sources. The press has been letting me down for a long time. Whenever I read enough about an outfit being hot and get pumped up to the point of checking out the goods, it is almost always a real come-down. Is that all there is? That is what the fuss is about? Never mind the lyrics, the singer's attitude, the girl's midriff, what about the music? They stink!!!

The one popular band that came out since the Pretenders that delivered for me was and is U2. For me, they have it all, and great gobs of it. I was a rock listener in the sixties, seventies and early eighties, but I have fled to jazz, blues, twentieth century "classical" (Schoenberg, Berg, Webern, etc.), Bach, Hayden, some new age-ish things, Santana, older Fleetwood Mac, Dr John. The nineties didn't make too big a dent in me, except Pearl Jam (especially), STP and Alice in Chains. NIN is like the new art rock. They come off like Yes to me, and that is not a good thing. The vocabulary has changed, but the content and intent is otherwise the same. More pretention than art; music in the service of substandard goals.

The stuff I checked out usually reminded me of the tripe on the Disney Channel. Soul-less, synthetic and too many former Mouseketeers. I wonder if these poor kids know they don't really have any musical talent.

I'm still waiting for another Pretenders, U2, Carlos Santana or Peter Green. In the meantime, thanks for the leads on other stuff that exists right now.

James Honeyman Scott, rest in peace.

Clark In Peoria