Hello... This site is Awesome!!

[L88P]

I am new to this site and have already gathered that a lot of you guys are into the "big stuff". I'm still into the L Series so I hope that's ok. I have a small collection that just seems to continue to grow... maybe in time I understand enough about the "big stuff" to make the jump. For now I'll introduce myself as L88P and list the members of my JBL family. I hope to post the family photo's soon! Glad to be a part of this wonderful web site! Thanks...

:banghead: The kids

L100 (Ingrid)
L166 (Ryan)
L112 (Sean)
L110 (Trisha)
L100 (Buster)
L100 (Jean)

The dog and cat

L46 :biting: L26 :eek:

[boputnam]

Hi! :wave:

So, do you run the siblings together, in a pack, or pairs, or as a gaggle... :rotfl:

Hoping to see your pics!

[scott fitlin]

Welcome to our place.

[L88P]

Originally posted by boputnam
Hi! :wave:

So, do you run the siblings together, in a pack, or pairs, or as a gaggle... :rotfl:

Hoping to see your pics!


Mostly in packs of 4... and then a couple of pairs. I hoping the wife is going to let me wallpaper this winter with little L's...

Nice meeting you Bo ! :)

[L88P]

Originally posted by scott fitlin
Welcome to our place.

Thanks Scott! :)

[Guido]

Wonderful to see a new JBL Maniac:bouncy:

[Ken Pachkowsky]

Welcome to the site L88P. You will find a great bunch of guys here that are more than generous with there time and advice re all aspects of our shared passion.

Enjoy!

Ken

[Ken Pachkowsky]

L-26's were the first JBL's I ever blewup. Ya gotta love Supertramps "Crime of the Century".

Sounded great just before they went "SMACK!"

Ken

[boputnam]

Originally posted by L88P
Mostly in packs of 4... and then a couple of pairs. I hoping the wife is going to let me wallpaper this winter with little L's... Well, just be careful what you do - you've got some inter-cabinet phasing issues you might wanna 'speriment with.

I'm not an expert on "your Family from L", but from the tech sheets kindly supplied by The One Giskard, here's what I gleaned:

L100
LF = (-)
MF = (-)
HF = (-)

L100A
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

L100A (Late Model)
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

L110
LF = (-)
MF = (+)
HF = (-)
(this is the more common JBL phasing - with LF being (-) )

L110A
LF = (-)
MF = (+)
HF = (-)

L112 - II
LF = (-)
MF = (+)
HF = (-)

L166/L166A
LF = (-)
MF = (-)
HF = (-)

What's the point - you ask? If you are pairing or grouping cabinets where like drivers are oppositely phased, you will get cancelling (rather than doubling). Say you walled the family room with the L112 and L166 - the MF's would be cancelling, providing a very different sound experience than walling with say, the L110's and L112 (they are phased alike).

Ha! If you paired the L100A's with the L110 or L112's, you wouldn't hear anything! :rotfl: Perfect! :thmbsup:

[Guido]

He Bo!

Stop the polarity discussion. :bash:

You know where it all ends up....:spin:

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Guido
Stop the polarity discussion. :bash: :rotfl: It was refreshing to dredge it all up again! Those were the days... :smthsail:

[4313B]

:barf:

[L88P]

Ya gotta love Supertramps "Crime of the Century".


Hi Ken... Thanks for the Welcome! Yep that's a classic. I always love the little L26. I just sold them to a guy who owns a Roadster shop in Arizona. I'll have to ask him where he's planning to use them.

see ya,

Roger :coolness:

[L88P]

So your the "One"


Thanks for the polarity on the L's...


Roger :coolness:

[L88P]

Hi Guido,

Thanks for the welcome... Ditto. My JBL maddness began in W. Germany back in 77. I've been able to supress this for a number of years but I'm afraid it's back and I might not be able to stop... cause now Bo and the "One" have me thinking about where this is all going... I saw a women in a bar Saturday night with an orange JBL tatoo... um!

Anyway, I'm posting a photo of my system as it was back in W. Germany back in 77. I've still running it... minus the orange grills.

Roger:coolness:

http://home.mchsi.com/~rboylan/L26/IngridsFlat.jpg

[Guido]

L88P,

I hope your memories to germany are not too bad:cool:

.....orange JBL tatoo..??

What bar and where?:beamup:

[L88P]

Hey Bo,

Thanks for heads up on the polarity and posting them. Wooo... almost forgot about the fine print... Lucky me, I just got most of them placed for position and wiring...

So an L100 and L166 can be paired together without a phasing concern?

The L100's with the black JBL label (Century) are:
LF = (-)
MF = (-)
HF = (-)

All of my L100's are offset...

L100's with the orange label are the A and late A models
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

My guess is the L88P's are like the L100 (Century) ?


Maybe I should see if this guy wants to trade these for a pair of L100's... would be a good start?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3057995959&category=3284&rd=1


See ya,

Roger :coolness:

[boputnam]

Originally posted by L88P
Anyway, I'm posting a photo of my system as it was back in W. Germany back in 77. I've still running it... minus the orange grills.
Whoa!! :shock: Completely RETRO!! :coolness:

And, those "stands" for the L100's - THAT's how you get good bass outa them... :rotfl:

Even better - I long for those days when the tele was an afterthought, stuffed off Stage Left somewhere. :thmbsup:

[boputnam]

Originally posted by L88P
So an L100 and L166 can be paired together without a phasing concern? Seems OK. So-long as it;s the L100 (and not the A).

And, apologies to all for raising this from the Dead. But, it is worth knowing, and even tho Don and I once spoke about preserving this dreaded JBL Polarity Convention stuff on a "sticky" somewhere, we've not yet got it done. :(

I gotta check on the L88 - be right back... :scoot:

[L88P]

Originally posted by Guido
L88P,

I hope your memories to germany are not too bad:cool:

.....orange JBL tatoo..??

What bar and where?:beamup:


Loved it... would like to go back some day for a visit. Loved driving through the small towns with the bricked roads. I lived in a small town SWABISH GMUND, do you know this town?


Loud ~N~ Crystal Clear


Roger:coolness:

[boputnam]

Originally posted by L88P
My guess is the L88P's are like the L100 (Century) ?
No.

The only schematic I have is for the L88 Nova and L88-1 Cortina, both with the 123A-1 and LE20-1.

L88 Nova and L88-1 Cortina
LF = (+)
HF = (+)

That is assuming the GRN lead connects to the Red Binding post on the cabinet (not labelled on schematic). Reasonable guess, though... Interesting, if one swaps in the 2213H (if the 123A is "not servicable") JBL advise to reverse polarity on the 2213H to preserve cabinet design.

The beast lives... :eek:

[L88P]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by boputnam
[B]Whoa!! :shock: Completely RETRO!! :coolness:

And, those "stands" for the L100's - THAT's how you get good bass outa them... :rotfl:


:hmm: Yep... JBL doesn't make shipping carton's like they use too... probably why they bring the xtra $600 on the auction block!!


Loud ~N~ Crystal Clear


Roger:coolness:

[L88P]

Originally posted by boputnam
Whoa!! :shock: Completely RETRO!! :coolness:

Even better - I long for those days when the tele was an afterthought, stuffed off Stage Left somewhere. :thmbsup:



Me to Bo... then :smthsail: and now :cooked:



Loud ~N~ Crystal Clear


Roger :coolness:

[L88P]

Originally posted by boputnam
No.

The only schematic I have is for the L88 Nova and L88-1 Cortina, both with the 123A-1 and LE20-1.

L88 Nova and L88-1 Cortina
LF = (+)
HF = (+)

That is assuming the GRN lead connects to the Red Binding post on the cabinet (not labelled on schematic). Reasonable guess, though... Interesting, if one swaps in the 2213H (if the 123A is "not servicable") JBL advise to reverse polarity on the 2213H to preserve cabinet design.

The beast lives... :eek:


Ok.. then assuming the LF & HF remain the same with the addition of the LE5-2 and plug in xover the MF should be (-) and would = the L100A or late model?? I'll check the GRN lead and let you know where it goes.

Thanks Bo!


Roger :coolness:

[boputnam]

Originally posted by L88P
Ok.. then assuming the LF & HF remain the same with the addition of the LE5-2 and plug in xover the MF should be (-) and would = the L100A or late model?? I'll check the GRN lead and let you know where it goes. Hey, Roger....

I'll bet the lead connected to the red post of the LE5-2 MF is WHT... Regardless, the question is - where is the other end of the WHT lead connected to - the RED or the BLACK cabinet binding post... :hmm: That's, what you need to discover to know how the MF is phased.

I've found, though, that there is no way to predict what might be with these things... ;)

[Robh3606]

Hey guys might want to look at this




Rob:)

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Robh3606
Hey guys might want to look at this :thmbsup:

What a goofy schematic. Whoa... They even put the LF on the bottom, opposite their some-times conventions!

Here's what I get:

L88P and L88P-A
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

That'd be identical to the L100A's (both of them). Figures, I 'spose.

That completes the "Family from L".

Thanks, Rob - I feel like having a cigarette... :o

[Naimless]

I'm relatively new to tearing into the innards of L100's, but the one thing that confuses me is that everyone refers to the "Red" post on the driver. Only the woofer in my L100's are marked thus; the MF and HF have male and female connectors with no polarity markings. Applying a tentative 1.5v cell to the male terminal results in a positive cone deflection in both MF and HF. So is the male connector the positive or negative ? The crossover schematics simply refer to "WHT", "BLK" and "RED".

I would like to replace the piano wire in my L100's with the same brand of speaker wire I have (Liberty Hi Def 14 gauge - don't knock it too bad, the price was right -Free!), hence the reason for my interest in phasing.

To compound the puzzle, my drivers are not stock - LE25-2 HF and LE5-10 Mid (just replaced with 104-H's since the LE 5's "scraped") and my crossovers do not have an inductor, just two caps and pot's.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, since I dearly love my old battered L100's - dubious phasing or not.

[Mr. Widget]

Welcome Naimless,

The search function up above on this forum works quite well. In any event the thread below should clear this up. Check out the fourth post.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=164

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Naimless
Applying a tentative 1.5v cell to the male terminal results in a positive cone deflection in both MF and HF. So is the male connector the positive or negative ? The crossover schematics simply refer to "WHT", "BLK" and "RED". Hey, Naimless... :wave:

When you say "positive" you mean cone out on positive signal, right? I'm confused by that. How are you connecting the 1.5v? To the cabinet terminals?

Both the MF and HF are negative by-design, so connecting directly to them will result in cone in on positive signal. There were three iterations of the L100 - see Page one of this Thread) - none of these gives MF and HF out on positive signal, if positive signal applied at the cabinet terminals (through the crossover).

For the MF - WHT is the positive lead.
For the HF - RED is the positive lead.

Make sense?

[Naimless]

Bo

I'm applying the 1.5v directly to the terminals of two spare drivers I have. What you said makes perfect sense, except that neither MF or HF drivers have any indication as to the polarity of the terminals. Both drivers have one male and one female spade connector. So applying the battery + to the male terminal and getting the cone to move out would mean that this is the negative terminal, since the driver is -ve.

I believe that I have a pair of L100A's, since the crossover lacks inductors and I need to check my LF driver to see if it is a 123A-1 or 123-A3 to verify if it is the L100A or L100A (late).

So from the driver table listed a couple of posts above, the LF should move in with + voltage applied to the red terminal, the same with the MF, but the HF should move out.

Thanks for the help !!!

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Naimless
...neither MF or HF drivers have any indication as to the polarity of the terminals. Both drivers have one male and one female spade connector. Hey, Hamish... Cool. I always get confused as to the sex convention of those "quick connect" connectors, but the WHT lead connects to what is the female, or "JBL positive" (i.e., industry negative), MF post.

However, at the risk of a friendship :duck:, I find I have to differ from Giskard's assesment per the Link provided by Widget. I was confused by his post, and I've now reviewed this again, and again, and with the 123A being a positive transducer, the L100 Century (first iteration) would be LF IN on positive to Red cabinet post (see the schematic closely - it specifically sez BLK "TO WOOFER RED"). Negative to a positive transducer, if you will, gives a cone IN in motion.

For your L100A's - both L100A's - are LF out when positive applied to Red cabinet terminal. That is, if connected JBL Factory...

:banghead:

[4313B]

- the female terminal on the transducer is "red" and the male terminal is "black".

Black is "hot" or "positive", just like in every properly wired home and business in the United States :D

JBL has since changed their polarity to match the rest of the miscreants who claim to manufacture audio transducers. :barf:

I tried to get Bill to buy JBL and then buy out, or crush, every other audio transducer manufacturer wanabe before JBL was forced to join the herd but he was busy that day.

[4313B]

Originally posted by Mr. Widget
Check out the fourth post.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=164 Naw! The fifth post is WAY better. The fourth post could be backasswards since Bo found that the original low frequency transducers were backasswards. The recone kits are wired "normal" :rotfl: At least some of them are ;) I guess the point now is to always double check :p

*****

BTW, if we need to redo that cheat sheet let's get Don to pull it and we can repost what Bo has since discovered.

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Giskard
I tried to get Bill to buy JBL and then buy out, or crush, every other audio transducer manufacturer wanabe before JBL was forced to join the herd but he was busy that day. :rotfl:

[boputnam]

:hmm: Hmm...

Reviewing this for a friend, I noticed an error with my reading of the L100A (Late Model). It should be:

L100A (Late Model) - 123A-3 woofer
LF = (-)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

And note this addition:

4311B - 2213H woofer
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

Apologies, and let the confusion resume!!

I fear even starting this thread again... :crying:


Well, just be careful what you do - you've got some inter-cabinet phasing issues you might wanna 'speriment with.

I'm not an expert on "your Family from L", but from the tech sheets kindly supplied by The One Giskard, here's what I gleaned:

L100
LF = (-)
MF = (-)
HF = (-)

L100A
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

L100A (Late Model)
LF = (+)
MF = (-)
HF = (+)

L110
LF = (-)
MF = (+)
HF = (-)
(this is the more common JBL phasing - with LF being (-) )

L110A
LF = (-)
MF = (+)
HF = (-)

L112 - II
LF = (-)
MF = (+)
HF = (-)

L166/L166A
LF = (-)
MF = (-)
HF = (-)

What's the point - you ask? If you are pairing or grouping cabinets where like drivers are oppositely phased, you will get cancelling (rather than doubling). Say you walled the family room with the L112 and L166 - the MF's would be cancelling, providing a very different sound experience than walling with say, the L110's and L112 (they are phased alike).

Ha! If you paired the L100A's with the L110 or L112's, you wouldn't hear anything! :rotfl: Perfect! :thmbsup: