Iwata Vs Smith horn

[gerard]

hello

I would like to know the difference in sound between an Iwata Horn and smith Horn used between 1000 hz up to 10 0000 hz .

I know in Europe that "Phil mundi" makes Iwata Horn using Jbl and Tad...

Regards

Gerard

[Phil Mundi]

hello

I would like to know the difference in sound between an Iwata Horn and smith Horn used between 1000 hz up to 10 0000 hz .

I know in Europe that "Phil mundi" makes Iwata Horn using Jbl and Tad...

Regards

Gerard
Bonjour, je pense que nous nous sommes contacté par tel au courant du mois d'Aout je présume?
Pour répondre à votre question, la différence est le jour et la nuit:blink:
Ayant écouté les 2 pavillons et les ai réalisez aussi ,y a pas photo.Pour conclure je trouve malheureux que JBL ai associé des 2 pouces comme les 2440 & 2441 à ce genre de pavillon!! qui pour moi la 2397 est très limité dans le régistre du bas médium et pour cause de longueur et la petitesse de l'épaisseur de la 2397 si je puis dire!
Avec les Iwata le chanteur(euse) est dans la pièce d'écoute:)
A bientot.
Phil Mundi.

[Tom Brennan]

Que?

[Hoerninger]

Bonjour, je pense que nous nous sommes contacté par tel au courant du mois d'Aout je présume?
Pour répondre à votre question, la différence est le jour et la nuit:blink:
Ayant écouté les 2 pavillons et les ai réalisez aussi ,y a pas photo.Pour conclure je trouve malheureux que JBL ai associé des 2 pouces comme les 2440 & 2441 à ce genre de pavillon!! qui pour moi la 2397 est très limité dans le régistre du bas médium et pour cause de longueur et la petitesse de l'épaisseur de la 2397 si je puis dire!
Avec les Iwata le chanteur(euse) est dans la pièce d'écoute:)
A bientot.
Phil Mundi.
Babelfish:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello, I think that we contacted itself by such with the current of August I suppose?
To answer your question, the difference is the day and the night:blink:
Having listened to the 2 houses and carry out as,y does not have photo.Pour to conclude I have them find unhappy as JBL associated of the 2 inches like the 2440 & 2441 this kind of house!! who for me the 2397 is very limited in the register of the low medium and due length and the smallness thickness of the 2397 if I then to say!
With Iwata the chanteur(euse) is in the part of listening:)
With soon.
Phil Mundi.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Peter :hmm:

[Mr. Widget]

Babelfish or Frenchfish.... I got about the same info from both.

I too am interested in the Iwata horns. What flare rates are used etc. I get the feeling that Phil is a bit protective of the products he is producing, however without a thorough discussion of what he is producing, I would expect sales to be limited.


Widget

[Jan Daugaard]

Machine translation leaves much to be desired, but it must in all fairness be said that the French text is garbled. This is a plausible translation:

"Hi, I believe we were in contact by telephone, sometime during the month of August? To answer your question, the difference is like day and night. Having listened to both horns, and made them, too,

[some text is missing]

there is no picture. In conclusion, I find it unfortunate that JBL has associated 2 inch drivers like the 2440 and the 2441 with this type of horn!!! To me, the 2397 is very limited in the lower middle range, because of the short length and the small height, if I may say so!
With a Iwata horn, the (female) singer is in the room.

See ya!
Phil Mundi"

[Mr. Widget]

Thanks Jan!

Now if Phil could back off on the flowery praise and explain what is good about the Iwata horns in a more objective way (pattern control, loading, frequency response, distortion etc.) I could get as excited about them as he obviously does.


Widget

[Jan Daugaard]

Bonjour Phil Mundi!

En ce qui concerne le pavillon Iwata, pourriez-vous fournir quelques spécifications techniques? Dispersion verticale et horizontale, courbe de response et distortions harmoniques etc..

Amicalement
Jan D.

(English translation: Hi Phil Mundi! Concerning the Iwata horn, could you provide some technical specifications? Vertical and horizontal dispersion, frequency response, harmonic distorsion etc.. Kind regards)

[Phil Mundi]

Bonjour Jan, merci pour la traduction presque simultanée:applaud: .
Pour les spécifications techniques les voici en bref: dispersion horiz.120° dispersion verticale 50°.La bande passante emploié dans sa partie la plus linéaire est de 300 hz à 9khz!! voir le graphique ci-joint.En ce qui concerne les distortions harmoniques , il faut ce référer à la Revue du Son de nov.1981 page 83 ou il est décrit sur graphique les distortions harmoniques 2 et 3.Les dimensions sont en image ci-joint.
http://users.pandora.be/philmundi/vend/img/mesuresIwata.gif
http://users.pandora.be/philmundi/vend/img/jbliwata.jpg


Bonjour Phil Mundi!


En ce qui concerne le pavillon Iwata, pourriez-vous fournir quelques spécifications techniques? Dispersion verticale et horizontale, courbe de response et distortions harmoniques etc..

Amicalement
Jan D.

(English translation: Hi Phil Mundi! Concerning the Iwata horn, could you provide some technical specifications? Vertical and horizontal dispersion, frequency response, harmonic distorsion etc.. Kind regards)

[Jan Daugaard]

As to the technical specifications, they are in short: Horizontal dispersion 120°, vertical dispersion 50°. The band-pass is most linear from 300 Hz to 9 KHz!! See the attached graph. Concerning harmonic distorsion, I have to refer to 'Revue du Son' from November 1981, page 83, where there are graphs for the 2nd and the 3rd harmonic distorsion. The dimensions of the horn are attached.

[Mr. Widget]

Thanks Jan! For all of us struggling to keep up with only our mother tongues you have really gone the distance.

Thanks for the info Phil. That seems like an excellent candidate for some of the Klipsch guys. (Not that it should be limited to them, but they are always looking for a horn that can go down pretty deep and they aren't opposed to using a tweeter.)

You might want to consider posting pictures and a thorough description of your horns over on the Klipsch forum... a photo or two posted here would be nice too. http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/


Widget

[Bruno GINARD]

Hi all,

For me IWATA horn shall be the next evolution in my system...3 months ago i changed the metallic 2390 for a TAD 4003 horn and... it's now impossible to come back to the old serpentine lense.

THe other advantage with an Iwata horn is to cut between 350 to 400 Hz, against 500 for the 2390 or 600/650 for the TAD.

Look at Dominique Jourdan home page ( north of France) :

http://persocite.francite.com/jodipav//

Regards

[Mr. Widget]

Hi Bruno,

That is a machined plywood horn that looks similar to a TAD horn, but it certainly isn't a TH-4003. The TH-4003 has a tuned AFAST duct and is asymmetrical in the vertical plane.

Your horn looks more like small version of the TH-4001 minus the vanes or perhaps a Fostex horn. Both of those horns are radial horns as is yours I believe.

Here is the TH-4003.


Widget

[lucfm]

Hi Bruno,

That is a machined plywood horn that looks similar to a TAD horn, but it certainly isn't a TH-4003. The TH-4003 has a tuned AFAST duct and is asymmetrical in the vertical plane.

Your horn looks more like small version of the TH-4001 minus the vanes or perhaps a Fostex horn. Both of those horns are radial horns as is yours I
believe.

Here is the TH-4003.


Widget

here is a most interesting link concerning horn profile design, in general, with a few words about Iwata horns.

http://www.audioasylum.com/scripts/t.pl?f=HUG&m=70972

Luc

[Bruno GINARD]

Hello Widget,

OOOOPs !You are right ! It's not original TAD horns but a copy of the TAD horn for 2"...

The external dimensions are the same, and the wave quides ( at the throw) were removed by the precedent owner.

About the model, i was persuaded it wad a 4001.....

However that may be, the result is better than the 2390...

I have'nt heard an Iwata horn, at the present time, but every people i've meet and who own those horns were delighted...

[Bruno GINARD]

.... i ve seen your pic, and compare with my horns.... Realy, the curve is not the same...:banghead:

I have plans of the TAD and will compare the steps of the curve from the throw to the mouth...

[lucfm]

Babelfish or Frenchfish.... I got about the same info from both.

I too am interested in the Iwata horns. What flare rates are used etc. I get the feeling that Phil is a bit protective of the products he is producing, however without a thorough discussion of what he is producing, I would expect sales to be limited.


Widget

I own since a few days four PDF files wich may contain useful informations as they are the Naota Iwata patents. Unfortunately, they are written in japanese and have been saved in image form only : I couldn't use Babelfish to translate...frustrating!!!
I would appreciate any help to solve this problem. The pdf are joined to my message.
52-48310 , 54-59129 , 54-45120 , JP 55 133 198. 20160

20161

20162

20163

Thanks.

Best regards,

Luc

[Hoerninger]

Thank you for your input!

they are written in japanese ...frustrating!!!
It seems to be like a secret. :(
Looking at the pdfs you will notice that each consists of several pages. There are tables and drawings. It is readily identifiable that this horn should create a sperical wavefront with growing radius.
____________
Peter

[gerard]

Why don't you ask Don Mc Ritchie for translating . I am sure he now has a lot of nice .... friends in Japan after his tokyo trip :D.


http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/2/26/250px-Geisha_Kyoto_Gion.jpg

Gerard

[lucfm]

Why don't you ask Don Mc Ritchie for translating . I am sure he now has a lot of nice .... friends in Japan after his tokyo trip :D.


Gerard

That would be a nice idea...don't you think , Don ??:D
Seriously, the Iwata patents can't be translated by the Japanese Patent Office free translation computer ( too old ( 1980 ) , only available for patents later than 1993 ) and the characters images saved in the pdf files cannot be recognised by OCR.:banghead:
The JP,55-133198,A ( 1980 ) seems to be the most interesting, followed by the 54-59129 and than the 52-48310 ( seems to be an original reactance annulling technique ).
Obviously, any information that could unveil some of the mystery about these excellent horns would be welcome.

Best regards,

Luc

[northwood]

Hi all,

For me IWATA horn shall be the next evolution in my system...3 months ago i changed the metallic 2390 for a TAD 4003 horn and... it's now impossible to come back to the old serpentine lense.

THe other advantage with an Iwata horn is to cut between 350 to 400 Hz, against 500 for the 2390 or 600/650 for the TAD.

Look at Dominique Jourdan home page ( north of France) :

http://persocite.francite.com/jodipav//

Regards
Gorgeous