AVR7300 & 412 Report

[PaulB]

OK, so the rack O gear is dwindling away on Ebay and the new HK receiver: AVR 7300 arrived yesterday and the 412's arrived today. First the bad news...
The 412's arrived damaged, one badly. One was clearly a return, the box was fine but the speaker had obviously been dropped hard. One corner was damaged to the point where there's a "crumple" line visible on the side of the cab. The other was seemingly brand new, but it arrived with a damaged grille (one pin broken off). I haven't been able to reach JBL yet, but since this was evidentally the lasttttt pair on Earth, and since I can't hear the slightest effect to the sound... I'm prolly going to keep them.

Now for the goods. This receiver KICKS ASS. I haven't owned an receiver in many years, so I'm likely out of date, but holy smokes! More flexibility than a Morrocan belly dancer, built like a Panzer and with titanium cajones. It does run hot as heck, and the cooling fan is just the tiniest bit noticeable BUT if you are in the market for a receiver get this on the HK clearance website TODAY! The Faroujda video processing is truly startling in it's effect, the various surround modes are fantastic, and it has tonssssssss of headroom. Couldn't be happier with the purchase, and for under a grand it's insane.

The 412's are very very nice, but certainly they aren't my old 4343's. Much brighter, and not as effortless sounding when it's time to really move some air. But, they have a great nicely balanced sound with beacoup bass (albeit not what I'm used to). In the lower mids they are beautiful, giving outstanding vocals. The upper mids are just the tiniest bit harsh but again, I've been listening to 4343's for 30 years :( . These ain't no anorexic sounding pencil speakers, nice full JBL sound with great staging, plenty of bass, and nice crystaline treble. And... 500 bucks for the pair? I guess I'm gonna live with the crumpled edge and do some repair work. I'm looking forward to breaking em in (but I already got a knock on the door, so maybe I'll take my time :D )

PaulB

[Titanium Dome]

Give yourself at least a couple of weeks to "break in" to your new speakers. You're going cold turkey from years of 4343 use, so you'll likely endure some changes.

The AVR7300 can help you with its amazing abilities to make the sound what you want, but give yourself a couple of weeks first.

[Rusnzha]

It's been about a month since you got those 412s. This 412 owner has been watching for your comments after letting go of your 4343s. Dammit, I wish I got them. But, the truth is, I get a big shit eating grin when I listen to mine.

[PaulB]

Well, listen... they aren't 4343's. Butttttttttttttttttttttttt for the price (especially the price I paid) I think they are fantastic. Nice tight abundant bass, very crystalline highs, great sound stage. I don't understand why they were discontinued, or why they weren't more appreciated.

[Rusnzha]

It's good to know there is life after owning 4343s and that the 412s seem to be doing it for you. The break in period on mine was a few months and they have aged well. Thanks for the update.

[Rusnzha]

PaulB -- How are your S412s doing? I just ordered an AVR 7300 to replace my Onkyo which is now on sale. I am dropping it into a 6.1 setup with a single rear speaker for now. I'm studying the owners manual so I don't have to waste a huge amount of time when it gets here.

There is one question I can't find an answer to that I hope you can help me with. They talk about 6.1/7.1, but I can't find anything that speciifcally deals with setting it up as a 6.1. Since you have been using one of these for a while, maybe you can fill me in on this?

Thanks,

Russ

[Rolf]

Give yourself at least a couple of weeks to "break in" to your new speakers.


The last time we discussed break in time I was accused for this: "oh no" "the first recorded albums was SVADA".

NOT by you TD:)

[PaulB]

Russ,
I'm sorry to say I don't know that I'll be much help to you. I run mine right now as 5.1, and will be adding my tag sale coup B&Ws for 7.1. But I'll tell you, you will be blown away by the 7300, it's an amazing receiver.

[Rusnzha]

Originally posted by PaulB



But I'll tell you, you will be blown away by the 7300, it's an amazing receiver.


You can take that to the bank -- It was there when I got home from work yesterday. I hooked everything up and I went into the menus (the instructions were driving me crazy, I probably have some kind of learning disability) and setup went easily and quickly. I used my SPL meter rather than using the automated setup. I also compared the SPL meter built into the remote with my Rat Shack meter. The Rat Shack read about 3 db higher, but this didn't have any effect on my level settings.

I finally played something and before 2 notes played, I was amazed by the sound. My Studio Series stuff rewarded me big time for feeding them better. This thing has the warmth and balls of a Mac and the soul of a Lexicon. Getting all this in a new unit for 900 bucks is a steal.

Logic 7 doesn't work with everything anymore than Neo 6 or PL2, but on the stuff it works with, it is a great additional choice. The Patricia Barber 2 channel SACDs really benefitted from Logic 7. All the surround modes sound a lot better than my retired Onkyo TX-DS 797. PL2x murders PL2. The one thing I didn't want when I upgraded was just an incremental improvement. I wanted something orders of magnitude better. I am as happy as a pig in crap.

On Friday, I will get the pair of indoor/outdoor S36s that I ordered. This will solve my rear channel issues and should make it sound even better.

[hjames]

Whoa - this puppy has separate Preamp level outputs for ALL CHANNELS??

So - you could feed LF & RF (left front & Right Front, e.g, the "stereo mains")
into an active crossover, and use that to feed a pair of biamped monitors?!

Way too cool This may be the thing that encourages me to finally give up my old stereo/theatre system JVC receiver with Dolby Pro, DTS, optical switching (and all of that environmental room create stuff that I've never used)...

Dang! It really does sound like a sweet system!

[Rusnzha]

It has 8 channels worth of pre-amp level outputs. There are probably a few ways to set up your stuff with this receiver.

http://www.onecall.com/ProductDetails.aspx?id=23716

http://www.ubid.com/actn/opn/getpage.asp?AuctionId=901339876&uwb=uwbc10052

Check these out for best price. I believe that these are new and not refurbs. Good luck!

I got mine from One Call, I had an email within an hour that it had shipped. Good place to get stuff from.

[johnaec]

Will those things drive 4 ohm loads safely? It seems like most the current home theater receivers/amps are restricted to 8 ohms. I've run into this problem numerous times driving my 4315A's. Even though they're rated 8 ohms, the impedence curve actually approaches 2 ohms at places, and I've tripped the breakers on a number of different receivers when pushing them.

I did finally pick up a JVC home theater receiver that has a switch in back for 4 or 8 ohms. Other than dedicated amps, this is the only one I've found that will let me consistently play the 4315A's at high level, if desired.

John

[Rusnzha]

There is nothing in the documentation that answers your question. Try calling Harmon product support @ 516-682-6438.

[Rusnzha]

I got the S36s up on the back wall today to complete my 7.1. I discovered that the AVR 7300 has individual channel level settings for each surround mode. This is a great feature. Anyway, I got everything adjusted and put on my Santana Caravansarai SACD -- This setup gets into your brain like a 4-way hit of LSD. I will have many eargasms!

[Rusnzha]

Just to follow up on this with a slightly better answer -- All the specs in stereo and multichannel are given at 8 ohms only. I don't suppose this would be good news for those of you who have speakers that present difficult loads. On the other hand, there is nothing saying you should only use only 8 ohm speakers. I guess it's the same answer with a little better explaination. Probably still doesn't help. I wish I had something better, but it won't come from this documentation. Anyone talk to Harman on this?

[hjames]

Okay - its been 2 1/2 years since I last visited this thread - you guys have had a chance to really thrash your gear and get to know it.

I've seen the AVR-7300 come up for sale from time to time and I've got to ask - now that you've had it for a while, what's your long-term feelings. Still really liking this unit?

I've got one of the lesser units AVR 335 - and its really nice - but I'm using preamp out for the front mains and sub to feed external amps and such ... I'd probably do the same with the 7300, but its got the Faroudja circuits and such for the video, and 110 watts/channel would help my surrounds ...

But it sounds like video performance is quite enhanced with this unit ...

What do you think, should I go chase one down?

[PaulB]

Speaking for myself, I still adore both the receiver and the speakers. I won't say that I think wistfully of my gigantic dearly departed rack O gear and the 4343s but for the money, it's a fabulous setup. If you find either the speakers or the 7300 you will not be sorry, guaranteed...

[jblnut]

If you're willing to sacrifice a little on the video side of the unit, you might look into the AVR7200. I picked one up used about 6 months ago. From what I can find, it's the largest and heaviest AVR ever made. It is a beast physically, but sonically it's a gem. I haven't gone to HDMI yet and I run the video directly into the TV.

Like most AVR's the remote is a nightmare and the FM tuner is bested by your average clock radio. But the amps are very sweet and extremely powerful. It has a useful (now with 2 levels) compressor for DD bitstreams to keep things quiet yet intelligeible at night. It has the a newer DTS decoder too and will do 6.1. It also has "global bass management" which lets you decide the xover frequency for all channels and the sub.

I sold my AVR300 for $100 and bought this for $300. All in all, a very useful upgrade for $200.

jblnut

[4313B]

It is a beast physically, but sonically it's a gem.I like it because it has that old school Harman Kardon sound that goes very well with legacy JBL loudspeakers.

[Rusnzha]

I haven’t once thought about getting another receiver since getting the AVR 7300. It puts out 110W/channel and if I turn it up enough, it will probably pop a circuit breaker. The S412Ps play clear and warm with it. I am happier with this set up than when I first got it. I have made some upgrades. The first was to get the Modwright treatment on my Sony NS999ES player. I liked Logic 7 when it worked, but I was constantly bouncing between it and PL2X. After getting the Modwright, Logic 7 became the default setting. It got a little goofy at times, but PL2x doesn’t come close to sonic qualities of Logic 7. The other upgrade was the LS Center. Logic 7 is 100% problem free since this came in. The LS Center has a nice synergy with the S412Ps, S38s and S36AWs. It is very satisfying to listen to at comfortable volume levels and really brings the music home. :dancin::banana:

[Rolf]

THAT is the way to do it! Send the picture to where in belongs ... to the TV. The sound?, well let the processor do the work. I am not so much into the 4.1, 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, 8, 9 or 10.1. I care more about the music ... in 2 channels. How many concert's have you been in with ? ch sound? They are on the stage, no ? ch sound there.


If you're willing to sacrifice a little on the video side of the unit, you might look into the AVR7200. I picked one up used about 6 months ago. From what I can find, it's the largest and heaviest AVR ever made. It is a beast physically, but sonically it's a gem. I haven't gone to HDMI yet and I run the video directly into the TV.

jblnut

[hjames]

THAT is the way to do it! Send the picture to where in belongs ... to the TV. The sound?, well let the processor do the work. I am not so much into the 4.1, 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, 8, 9 or 10.1. I care more about the music ... in 2 channels. How many concert's have you been in with ? ch sound? They are on the stage, no ? ch sound there.

I do have my stereo system with the L200s/3-ways that are basically 4333s - but this question was about the AVR-7300 multichannel receiver.

I use my downstairs system with a Harman Kardon AVR 335 frontend and biamped 4341s mostly in stereo mode for music, - but I do use it in multichannel 5.1 mode for TV, Movies, surround stuff - whatever

I had asked for perspectives on the Harman Kardon AVR 7300 gear from OWNERS of that gear.

Why would you give your opinion on multichannel sound equipment if you don't even like or USE multichannel sound equipment?

THIS forum is Lansing Product General Information
Its all about music, and movies, and so much more ...

[jblnut]

I consider myself very fortunate to be able to have two rooms, and I appreciate being able to listen to music in either 2 channel or surround. Both have their place and I can easily find something to like about either one.

For the record, Pink Floyd was the only touring band I saw (and heard) with multi-channel sound. It has been done, but not by many.

Let's play nice please...

jblnut

[Rusnzha]

The sound?, well let the processor do the work. I am not so much into the 4.1, 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, 8, 9 or 10.1. I care more about the music ... in 2 channels. How many concert's have you been in with ? ch sound? They are on the stage, no ? ch sound there.

True enough, but there are a lot of ways to audio nirvana. I always thought multi channel had a lot of interesting possibilities, I'm doing fine with that and JBL. You have stuff that most of us can only dream about and that's got to be fine :cheers:

[Rolf]

Sorry for my confused head. Just read the post, and comment.


I do have my stereo system with the L200s/3-ways that are basically 4333s - but this question was about the AVR-7300 multichannel receiver.

[Mr. Widget]

[FONT=Arial]After getting the Modwright, Logic 7 became the default setting. In my opinion, Logic 7 is the best part of HK receivers... since Harman owns Lexicon, they can put it in even their more basic units... pretty nice. That's something that Denon, Yamaha, and the others just can't do.


Widget

[ka7niq]

Speaking for myself, I still adore both the receiver and the speakers. I won't say that I think wistfully of my gigantic dearly departed rack O gear and the 4343s but for the money, it's a fabulous setup. If you find either the speakers or the 7300 you will not be sorry, guaranteed...
I owned, and liked the AVR 7000.
I got a Yamaha RX V1 in a trade, using it with the JBL S412P's.
Works fine, really LOVE the S412P''s :)
I spoke with Greg Timbers a week or so ago about the 412's.
Greg said he was VERY pleased with them.
I asked for a crossover schematic to swap out the NPE caps in the S412P's to better poly caps.
Honestly, I like the JBL S 412 P's SOO much, afraid to mess with them !
My S412's sound a LITTLE betteer using the RX V1 as a preamp to drive a Luxman M 117 and a GTDAudio 750 amp on the JBL S412P's.
But not "enough" to leave things that way.
So, I placed the big GTDAudio 750 amp back on my passive subwoofers, and run the 412;s off only the Yamaha RX V1.
The JBL S412's are everything I hoped my L7's would be.
I have the matching S Series 3 way Center speaker, except it is Silver, and my S412'P's have copper colored drivers.
Mine are series ones, done by Greg Timbers.
The silver colored drivers are series 2 S412P's, slightly re done by another engineer.
I have never compared the two series.
Greg Timbers told me ALL the speakers in THAT series were extremely good.
We BOTH wondered why that series never "caught on" ??
I am reluctant to give up the Yamaha RX V1
It has Yamaha's 44 bit DSP with FRONT surround speakers that REALLY stretch the soundfield.
Once you have HEARD Yamaha's DSP system properly set up with ALL the speakers arrayed in your room, there IS "no going back" IMHO.
The front surround speakers created DEPTH in the front soundstage like you have never heard.
Transforming your home into something better then most Movie Theatres.
DTS, 7.1, THX, Dolby Digital and Pro Logic ALL pale by comparasion.
2 CH on the Yamaha RX V1 is NOT as good as my best High End Preamps/Amps, but it is still musical.
I am SOO Sold on the Yamaha DSP system, that I will not even consider any receiver/processor lacking it!
I have a Onkyo 919 THX Receiver, and recently sold a Big JVC RX DP 9.
The Onkyo 919 is a beast, THX Ultra rated at 250 wpc into 4 ohms!
The JVC was a nice receiver, all individual power supply caps, and JVC's Upsampler CC Convertor built in.
VERY nice sounding, able to laugh at 4 ohm loads too.
But NO front surround speakers, and 44 bit LSI DSP like the Yamaha :banghead:

[ka7niq]

In my opinion, Logic 7 is the best part of HK receivers... since Harman owns Lexicon, they can put it in even their more basic units... pretty nice. That's something that Denon, Yamaha, and the others just can't do.


Widget
Logic 7 ?
Never heard it.
Does it use FRONT surround/effects speakers like Yamaha does with 44 bit LSI DSP ?
IF so, it might be something I will consider :)

[MikeBrewster77]

http://www.harmankardon.com/technology/default.aspx?act=glossary&term=Logic%207

Best,
- Mike


Logic 7 ?
Never heard it.
Does it use FRONT surround/effects speakers like Yamaha does with 44 bit LSI DSP ?
IF so, it might be something I will consider :)

[Rusnzha]

Logic 7 ?
Never heard it.
Does it use FRONT surround/effects speakers like Yamaha does with 44 bit LSI DSP ?
IF so, it might be something I will consider :)

Lexicon is one of the two best companies making processors for musical instruments. They got into home audio and surround sound before anyone knew what home theater was. Their stuff was high dollar and second to none. When I got my 7300 and tried Logic 7, I was disappointed at first. It could sound good, but at the expense of an overly fat sound and a lack of clarity and detail. Since making the improvements in my setup, Logic 7 delivers everything I believed Lexicon processing promised. I heard a Yamaha a few years ago with a set of Deftec speakers. In stereo, they sounded like crap. With the Yamaha processing, they sounded pretty good, but it was obvious that there was some heavy processing going on. I wondered if my 412s would sound the same as the Deftecs if I used the same processing. Logic 7 processing is much less noticeable. It sounds closer to stereo than any of the other surround modes, but it puts the music into an amazing space. The sound becomes solid and you can just about smell it in the air. It doesn’t sound gimmicky in any way. I guess opinions are like butts, everybody has one and it stinks :blah:. My opinion is that Logic 7 rules in multi-channel setups.



I don't know about front surrounds, On the HK 7300, it can be used in 5.1 and 7.1.

[hjames]

When I got my 7300 and tried Logic 7, :blah: :blah: :blah:.
My opinion is that Logic 7 rules in multi-channel setups.
On the HK 7300, it can be used in 5.1 and 7.1.

Okay - asking this to the OWNERS of AVR-7300 receivers ...

So - if I can get a used AVR-7300 for $400 with all the parts and accessories, would you think that's a reasonable deal?

I'd have to sell off my HK AVR-335 (its got Logic 7) and a Yamaha RX-N600,
but I won't miss them with this kind of a power upgrade ..

[ka7niq]

http://www.harmankardon.com/technology/default.aspx?act=glossary&term=Logic%207

Best,
- Mike
Thanks, I still can't seem to find out if the Logic 7 has front surround speakers ?

[hjames]

Thanks, I still can't seem to find out if the Logic 7 has front surround speakers ?

Logic 7 is a 7.1 system

LF Center RF (fronts)
SUB (place as applicable)
LS RS (side surrounds)
LR RR (rear surrounds)


Are you asking about front Surround in addition to Front Mains?

[Rusnzha]

Okay - asking this to the OWNERS of AVR-7300 receivers ...

So - if I can get a used AVR-7300 for $500 with all the parts and accessories, would you think that's a reasonable deal?

I'd have to sell off my HK AVR-335 (its got Logic 7) and a Yamaha RX-N600,
but I won't miss them with this kind of a power upgrade ..

This should work out nicely for you, I would do it :blah::blah::blah: !!!!
The power supply is beastly in it with big toroidal transformer. It weighs about 55 lbs. If you are having it shipped, send a few extra bucks to have it professionally packed.



Originall posted by ka7niq
Thanks, I still can't seem to find out if the Logic 7 has front surround speakers ?
I believe front surrounds is strictly a Yamaha innovation. This is not a concern for me, but if you insist on having these, by all means, stick with Yamaha :bash: !!

[hjames]

This should work out nicely for you, I would do it :blah::blah::blah: !!!!
The power supply is beastly in it with big toroidal transformer. It weighs about 55 lbs. If you are having it shipped, send a few extra bucks to have it professionally packed.

I believe front surrounds is strictly a Yamaha innovation. This is not a concern for me, but if you insist on having these, by all means, stick with Yamaha :bash: !!

Thanks for the info!
It was a local buy - I missed one for $20 less over the weekend, but this was a fine deal ...
Just brought it home, tho hookup will have to wait for the weekend ...

... but sheesh, its HEAVY, and its HUGE!

7 channels at 110watts each - whew!

[jblnut]

Thanks for the info!
It was a local buy - I missed one for $20 less over the weekend, but this was a fine deal ...
Just brought it home, tho hookup will have to wait for the weekend ...

... but sheesh, its HEAVY, and its HUGE!

7 channels at 110watts each - whew!

You should see (and lift) the 7200 sometime :)

Congrats on finding what you wanted! I doubt very much you will be disappointed (tuner and remote excepted of course...).

jblnut

[Rusnzha]

Thanks for the info!
It was a local buy - I missed one for $20 less over the weekend, but this was a fine deal ...
Just brought it home, tho hookup will have to wait for the weekend ...

... but sheesh, its HEAVY, and its HUGE!

7 channels at 110watts each - whew!

Cool, let us know how it works out.

[hjames]

Cool, let us know how it works out.

My god - this thing is MAJOR steps above the AVR-335 - got it set to loop TIVOHD and AppleTV (just for music) Vids through the Composite Vid circuit ...
really seems to clean everything up - pix are gorgeous - even on lower res stuff like BBC America ...
(I did have the Apple TV and the OPPO vids on an external HDMI switch and to the TV, now its just the OPPO HDMI direct to the TV,
and if I can find another RGB cable I may loop the OPPO composite through too, just as a test).

Overall audio sounds great - still running in 5.1 mode (max) (no room for another pair of speaks!)
and stereo for CDs and such, plus still have the preamp out feed to the biamp gear and the 4341s -
but even sound quality for that seems to have stepped up a notch.

Def a great improvement on sources!

I'm half tempted to pull the biamp rack out of the path for a bit and just let the receiver run everything,
just to see how it does.

I mean - I've got 2425s to install at some point so the rack has to come off the left speaker for a while anyway ...

I do think I'm going to REALLY hate the remote as time goes by,
but once I select sources I can use the TIVO remote for volume and mute.

Thanks to you guys for the feedback - I do appreciate your inputs!

[hjames]

One final comment - pulled the rack and found the OPPO DV981hd didn't HAVE composite (RGB) outs - so -
I've left it with its HDMI line tied directly to the TV, and left all the OPPO's various audio outs
(Analog L and R, 6 Direct for SACDs and DVD-A, and optical for Movies etc) tied directly to the AVR 7300.
Still sounds great!

Played a bit of the Tommy SACD - very nice!

We played a TIVOHD recording from Palladia channel (shares the channel with MTVHD I think ??) of The Who - Electric Proms - it was originally done for BBC3. Amazing clear video and really fine audio. 2005-06 era Who, I think.
Pity its a 50 min show with commercials - I'd love to get the whole 2 hour show on DVD!

Anyway, it looked and sounded amazing!

[jblnut]

That's interesting about HDMI still working with the other audio outs. I was under the impression (mistaken perhaps) that when you used HDMI, all the other audio and video outs were muted as part of some kind of copy protection scheme baked into HDMI. Now maybe the Oppo doesn't have this "feature", but I'd be interested to hear from anyone else who uses HDMI. Does it still allow you to use your digital audio outs ?

jblnut

[hjames]

Another thing - I had bought 2 HK changers in recent years as they had the Brown-burr chip used to decode HDCD discs. Unlike SACDs, HDCD can be played in regular CD players and sound normal, but with HDCD decoding, you get extra information and a better sound.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDCD
"HDCD encodes the equivalent of 20 to 24 bits (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit) worth of data in a 16-bit digital audio signal by using custom dithering (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dither), audio filters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_filter), and some reversible amplitude and gain encoding; Peak Extend, which is a reversible soft limiter and Low Level Range Extend, which is a reversible gain on low-level signals. There is thus a benefit at the expense of increase in noise"

Anyway - yesterday I tried one of my HDCD discs in the OPPO player. the Obisash remaster of Bryan Ferry's Boys and Girls. I had originally set the HK AVR 7300 CD input to use the analog rca pair - and it worked well, but reading the manual said to use the digital input. So, I went into setup, pointed the CD input to the Optical 3 input, saved the settings, and tried again. This time I can see the letters HDCD displayed on the lower part of the receiver's display!
So - no more dependance on the player decoding the HDCD - the receiver does it, so I could use any quality player with optical outs! Very cool!

[Rusnzha]

Originally posted by hjames


#1 HK AVR7300 + 4341 , LC2, B380 sub, L20T3, L20T
#2 Yamaha CR-2040 + L200 3ways + L100T


It looks like you stuck with the AVR 7300 rather than bi-amping your 4341s. I'm curious how the different amp set ups compare with each other :confused:.

PS - I need to borrow a camera, but will post some shots of my set up in the next few days.

[Hoerninger]

So, I went into setup, pointed the CD input to the Optical 3 input, ... the receiver does it, so I could use any quality player with optical outs! Very cool!

I want to second this experience, although it took me quite a time to realize it.
Audio-CD, MP3-CD, DVD-Dolby, DVD-DTS are played with one setting, SACD and DVD-A with another one when in multichannel mode. For the latter the analog/digital switching is done automatically.

(Unfortunately SACD und DVD-A via analog are mediocre compared to DTS via optical - Pioneer player into Panasonic receiver.
What about the Oppo?)
____________
Peter

[Rusnzha]

I want to second this experience, although it took me quite a time to realize it.

(Unfortunately SACD und DVD-A via analog are mediocre compared to DTS via optical - Pioneer player into Panasonic receiver.
What about the Oppo?)
____________
Peter

This has more to do with the analog section of your player. Better analog outputs will smoke the digital modes, but they ain't cheap :banghead:

[Hoerninger]

This has more to do with the analog section of your player. ... :banghead:
No doubt, but with the Oppo is there SACD /DVD-A via analog better than DVD-DTS via digital?
___________
Peter

[Rusnzha]

No doubt, but with the Oppo is there SACD /DVD-A via analog better than DVD-DTS via digital?
___________
Peter

Sorry, my mistake.

[hjames]

Originally posted by hjames


It looks like you stuck with the AVR 7300 rather than bi-amping your 4341s. I'm curious how the different amp set ups compare with each other :confused:.

PS - I need to borrow a camera, but will post some shots of my set up in the next few days.

I have temporarily hooked the AVR 7300 directly to my 4341s in regular mode. I have to pull the biamp rack so I can put a new pair of 2425s into the speakers and this lets me use the system while the rack is out of the way (gets the weight off the cabinet so I can move them!) ...

Swapping the driver into the right cabinet with just the Citation on it is easy, but the rack on the left speaker must be approaching 100lbs - so between the 4341 cabinet weight and the rack weight, thats an awful lot of weight to trust to the 2 x4 wheeled plinths I made for general movements.

So, I'll pull the power amps out of the rack so I can lighten the load, then spin the rack away from the wall, pull the upper rear panel so I can access the 2420s I bought them with, and put in the rebuilt 2425s with aquaplassed ti diaphrams, and I'm that much closer to having them fully refurbed.

But I plan to go back to the biamping in a month or so, once I've swapped the new horn drivers into place.

About running on just the AVR 7300 instead of having the fronts biamped. ... Whats most noticable is the bass isn't as crisp with the 4 drivers and original passives of the 4341s on the AVR 7300's 110w/ch as it is with the EQ and distinct JBL/UREI amps.
There is more to it, and its a subtle change, buts the most obvious difference.

[Rusnzha]

I have temporarily hooked the AVR 7300 directly to my 4341s in regular mode. I have to pull the biamp rack so I can put a new pair of 2425s into the speakers and this lets me use the system while the rack is out of the way (gets the weight off the cabinet so I can move them!) ...

Swapping the driver into the right cabinet with just the Citation on it is easy, but the rack on the left speaker must be approaching 100lbs - so between the 4341 cabinet weight and the rack weight, thats an awful lot of weight to trust to the 2 x4 wheeled plinths I made for general movements.

Those racks are serious. I'm surprised that the 7300 compares as well as it did. It does great with the 412s, but the 4341 is something else.


So, I'll pull the power amps out of the rack so I can lighten the load, then spin the rack away from the wall, pull the upper rear panel so I can access the 2420s I bought them with, and put in the rebuilt 2425s with aquaplassed ti diaphrams, and I'm that much closer to having them fully refurbed.

But I plan to go back to the biamping in a month or so, once I've swapped the new horn drivers into place.

Nice project, It will be amazing when you get them back together.


About running on just the AVR 7300 instead of having the fronts biamped. ... Whats most noticable is the bass isn't as crisp with the 4 drivers and original passives of the 4341s on the AVR 7300's 110w/ch as it is with the EQ and distinct JBL/UREI amps.
There is more to it, and its a subtle change, buts the most obvious difference.

Describing the effect of the LS Center is something like that. It will take some time to understand and describe all the subtleties and characteristics it brings home.

[hjames]

As you saw with the pictures I posted, I was off Monday so I had time to swapped the mid/horn drivers into the 4341s. I got the rack partly Assembled, but no time to connect it back in. So, last night I pulled the front mains outs off the 7300 Amp outs, and put the fronts preamp-outs > biamp rack wiring back into place -
but - it had gotten late, so I had no time to really shake it down at higher levels.
Maybe tonight, if all goes well ...